Concerning 'Colors'.

[BadgerOctane]

I've been asked to bring this subject here from another forum in order to clarify several things about something I'm sure you're all familiar with, the 1%er lifestyle. You know all about it thought don't you? You've read the headlines, seen the news at 10, heard the rumors and you know just how BAD these 1%ers can be don't you? Would it surprise you, that you've only heard one side of this? Would it surprise you that you've likely met several 1%ers and never even knew it? Where did you meet them? Well, maybe at the bank.... maybe he was handing you your money from that check you just cashed. Maybe as you were getting your gums looked at in that dentist chair, the man peering into your chompers was a 1%er, and the next time you find you need an attourney for something, would it surprise you that he could be affiliated?

Like I said, this is kind of a dark subject and I've been asked to bring a little light to it. But first some ground rules for this thread:

1. The author of this thread has no intentions of misleading, or misportraying any of the context here. This thread is for educational purposes and shall remain that way.

2. This is not an attempt at recruitment of any kind. All opinions and beliefs are welcomed and respected, please do not flame anyone here for their views, opinions or beliefs. We can politely disagree, and be disagreed with because after all, we each come from all walks of life. Just because we all enjoy life on two wheels doesn't mean we have the rest of the world in common. Be respectful of it, but please speak your opinions and ask questions.

3. There will be no specific name dropping of clubs. I'd like to keep all official names out of this, UNLESS used to cite a specific reference to a period of time, documented by historical record. I cannot speak for other clubs, and thus I can not be certain of their ways, methods, rules and such. I only know what I myself have experienced and or been told. Also, I cannot and willnot answer any questions that reveal specific location, number of members, names of certain members or anything like that. If I say that I cannot answer a question, please find another question, or possibly rephrase your's so it is not so direct.

As you can see this is a topic typically sensitive in nature. A little later on I'll explain why its so sensitive. However first I'll start with the colors in general. For any who might not understand, colors are the vests, or insignias worn by M/C clubs. Not just 1%ers mind you. They are a way of saying that the person wearing them is a member of a certain M/C. So lets talk about these colors.

When you earn your colors, you EARN them. You can't buy them, no one will just give them to you, you have to work hard and follow guidelines, and even take a little hell now and then but all that is to make certain you are a worthwhile person.

Think of it like joining a family, you're either born in, or you're accepted by the family in some way. To be accepted you have to prove that you're willing to be a member who's soul concern is the prosperity and well being of that family. If you're not proud to be in that family, then you're better off not being among them in the first place right?

That's a small sense of what colors are, a reflection that you're a member of a family, that you support and uphold the beliefs and values of that family and that you have also become accepted by that family. They will defend you, just as you will defend them.

I realize I'm being a little vague here, but I'm trying to keep bias opinions out of it.

Your colors also reveal your place in that family so to speak, and depending on the club. Say you're walking down the street, you see a man, woman and child all walking together, you can assume he is the father, she is the mother, and this is their child. Something similar happens with your colors in a sense, you have a position within that family. You have a designated purpose and you are important. The group needs you, just as much as you need them, and together you are strong, together you are all family.

Some minor guidelines to these colors are:

As far as do's and don'ts go, no matter what your place with the group, you display your colors, even if the only patch you hold reads the word, "Prospect". This one you've already mentioned.

You alone wear your colors, since you alone earned them.

You have an equal voice in who else should wear the colors of your club, as the club has an equal voice in assuring that you will still retain yours.

Colors are a reflection of your family, any threat made to those colors is a threat upon your family.

Your colors show that the property in which you own is considered family property, they will help you defend it, and you will help defend theirs.

Your colors show your Constitutional freedoms in the right to assembly, and freedom of speech.

Many things can be said about colors. Pros and Cons, do's and dont's, rights and wrongs... and you'll find that there are many variations and different rulings depending on which club you are referring.

Be it known, that no matter which club anyone rides with, or what they think of other clubs we all share one thing in common... that we enjoy life on two wheels.

This questions was once asked of me about colors by a member of another forum:


Badger

Personally, I have seen only two 'rules' broken--and these were by people that obviously EARNED their patches. First was covering of the colors (ie, came into a bar and removed jacket to reveal a patch covered vest). Second was coming back into a bar to retrieve his colors--(different guy)--not only did he take off his colors, he left without them. Peace

My reply was such:

Well, as mentioned different clubs will have different rules so to speak, but there could also be another factor involved, and here's an example:

Here in Colorado, there are still a few bars with a "No Colors" rule. And I'm not talking about 60's segregation they clearly mean that you cannot display something that reflects an affiliation to which there could potentially be a rival and thus cause for dispute.

Basically they just don't want any trouble, nor do they want to lose business because individuals might percieve the establishment as biased.

In that case, that particular club, or clubs, would likely respect the given rules of the establishment, and abide accordingly. Covering of the colors, or even removing them could then be acceptible, again depending on the club.

The key word is 'respect' not only to yourself and fellow members, but to the world and it's people around you as well.

There are many things we've heard, "Do unto others...." "Act not lest ye be judged...." and many of these are used commonly in some clubs. (I'll bet not many knew that.)

So those members might not have been disrespecting their colors, but rather respecting an in house rule. Though true, forgetting your colors not only makes you look stupid, its grounds for a foot in the ass or two.
---------------------------------

So at this time I'd like to see what questions come about. Remember, this thread's purpose is for education. Sooner or later, you're going to encounter a 1%er and possibly a group of them, with this knowledge, you'll see that patch holders are people too, and you need not feel intimidated by anyone. :)

BadgerOctane

[Dyna Jim]

In respect to esatblished M/C's and long established colors, there has to be age old rivalries that exists between many of these clubs. Say for instance your at a rally or event, is the the chance that participating ( say you purchased an item from a clubs display or stand), or even communicating with one M/C or another will cause you grief with another M/C club later at that event?

I've seen clubs selling parts etc at swap meets and the sort, and have wondered what if any reprocussions there could be. I know in general wearing a supporting items could get you in hot water, I just wonder what else is taboo..

[BadgerOctane]

Excellent questions Jim.

Here's how 'Support' gear works. Support gear is just that, some sort of item, usually clothing that reads 'Support your local ______ M/C.' Support gear is almost unofficial colors, it says you as a person are in favor of the _____ M/C. A rival M/C might have an issue with this, however it would not be directly displayed at an event and here's why.

The 'House Rule': Respect is shown where respect is given.

At events, runs, public gatherings etc. If an M/C is allowed to display their wares, usually support gear and often some misc used bike parts for swap etc. They are there under permission from the establishment or event hosts. They are merely there to raise money for their chapter, and in a way spread their name so that potential new prospects may come about. Its also known that at many of these events known rival clubs are present. The reason why 9 times out of 10 no fights break out has nothing to do with security at these events at all. Truth be known, 1,000 cops at a big event would only be fodder should anything go down. The House rule, is basically respecting the establishment that has allowed your passage. The rules of that establishment written or not are, "NO FIGHTING ON THESE GROUNDS". And basically if an M/C wants to be invited back they will respect this written or unwritten rule. They being allowed to be a vendor there is a benefit to their club, so they don't want to jeopardise it by bickering.

That being said, here's how support gear falls into it. At these events, likely no one would really say much as they are respecting the house rule. But sometimes its best to make a small comment. Many people don't realize their support shirts can offend other M/Cs. So usually a polite explanation is in order. However outside of the event realm, where the house rule might not be in effect, that support gear could bring about some grief. I realize this is a poor example, but say you were standing in a church of Christ and suddenly a guy strolled in wearing a pro satan shirt or something. What do you think the overall reaction would be by devout followers of Christ? Probably wouldn't be a very pretty picture would it? And yet this guy might not even know he's done something wrong.

The main thing is respect. Ignorance can cause some grief. Many people think its cool to wear support gear anywhere they go, and yet they don't realize there are territories where such things are considered offensive. Most times, words are exchanged and the situation becomes a hard and humiliating verbal lesson on the issue. Sure it can be very intimidating looking at several guys who are all wearing the same looking vest and all right there focused on you, but the truth is they're not looking for a fight, they just want it to be known that a fight isn't welcome, nor is disrespect.

BadgerOctane

[BadgerOctane]

I think now might be a good time to talk about 'Mediated Reality'. You've seen in papers how the member of this M/C was jailed for shooting a member of that M/C. You've seen how several members of this M/C were incarcerated for drug trafficing. You've seen how a member of this M/C was found dead and his killers are still at large....

But what you don't see, is the spin that the media can put on things. Movies from the 60's and 70's didn't help this matter. Bikers have long been portrayed as ruthless, cut-throat outlaws who only care about getting drunk and causing trouble. Sure it makes for great Hollywood and can do pretty well at the box office, but lets face it, there was quite a bit of exploitation here. "Why didn't these bikers stand up and speak out?" Well, here's where marketing comes in, this kind of attention drew more members.

I'm not going to stand up here and say that bikers haven't done some bad things. That aspect is very true, some have done some bad things, but not all of them. Sure they may wear the same colors, but you can't blame an entire group for one man's actions. There might be one bad apple in a bunch. Sometimes you get a guy who feels he has to prove himself, look most if not all of us went to high school and experienced sports right? You know what I'm talking about here.

"So how did all this 1%er business come about?"... "What are 'outlaw' bikers?" These are terms that were placed on a select group of bikers M/Cs that were not sanctioned by the AMA. I don't know specific dates of when, but this is history and what I'm talking about here can be looked up. Basically the AMA said that those groups of bikers did not make up the 99% of the biking community and so the 1%er term was born. 'Outlaw' was another term placed upon 1%er organizations by the AMA. Specifically it was in reference to a band or several bands of boys who were just back from WWII. Many of them named their clubs after the names of their fighting squadrons during the war. These are names you recognize today, but perhaps you never knew these names were war related and dated back farther than the clubs who represent the names? I hope this makes sense.

Think about it, boys just back from a war, back stateside and they're pretty happy. Some of them got to bring their bikes back, (few, but some.) and they had become a band of brothers already during the war. They already knew how to watch each other's back, and support each other. And sure at this age they had some beers and got a little rowdy. Well this made headlines. And here's where I break down everything for you.

M/C 'A'. Gets drunk, gets kicked out of a bar, and it was a bit of a scrap. But overall it wasn't that bad of a deal. No arrests, nothing like that, police show up and break it all up, everyone goes home, they'll sleep it off. However it did appear in the news paper.

A guy from M/C 'B' sees this. "Hey guys, look what M/C A did.... Aww man we can do better than that, come on guys." So M/C B raises a little more hell, and this time it actually makes the front page of the newspaper.

Well M/C A doesn't want to seem second rate so they up the ante even more, and a couple of their boys land in jail overnight or for a couple days.

By this time M/C 'C' has heard enough of these two, and its time to not only make local news, but the news of the surrounding counties as well.

You see where I'm going with this? Yes I guess in a sense much of it was born from a juvenile aspect, but think about it. They were only 18 when they went to war, by this time they're not that much older and now they can pick up where they left off because they were kind of denied their youth because of the war. But this right here is where the outlaw and 1%er terms come from. The AMA didn't like these groups of rowdy boys making all bikers look bad so naturally they had to make these comments to show the public, just because someone rides a bike, doesn't mean they're bad.

Be thankful for the AMA though, because without them, this forum or you and I might not be here right now discussing this. And if you're into custom choppers be thankful for these groups, this 1% of the biking community who decided to 'bob' their war bikes to make them lighter, faster and more sporty so to speak.


BadgerOctane

[Ammoman]

How are non 1% riders viewed by 1%ers?
Can I approach a 1%er and ask questions about their M/C or are you invited?
Is there another term besides 1%? Seems to be to politically correct for the reputation.
There are obvious groups that have reputations that are infamous but are there factions within those groups that say... are more open minded than others?

[BadgerOctane]

Basically a person is judged by his or her actions and words. So if a person seems cool and friendly, rightly so will a 1%er be. A simple, 'hello' or even a smile and a nod is most often returned with such. Basically if a person is being themselves and being respectful of others, they are generally smiled upon by 1%ers because that person isn't out to cause trouble or anything like that, they're having a good time just like anyone else.

Can I approach a 1%er and ask questions about their M/C or are you invited?

It honestly depends on the question and of course how its asked. We've all heard that 'its not what you say but how you say it'. That is very true. So if you have a genuine honest question you can certainly ask it. Questions to avoid are direct or specific questions that reveal names of members, number of members, locations, etc. And if your question can't be answered you may get an answer of, "I'll have to refer you to an officer of my chapter who can answer that." or "I'm afraid I cannot answer that question for you." Like I said, if you're courteous, respectful and honest, you'll likely get the same in return. If you think that your question could be offensive, simply state, "I don't mean to offend, but I'd like to ask...." I don't recommend starting a conversation with this though. Start with normal small talk like anyone else. Introduce yourself, your curiousity will be very apparent so don't be afraid to ask questions, just don't make them too specific. Questions are honestly welcomed by M/Cs. Education defeats misconception.

Is there another term besides 1%? Seems to be to politically correct for the reputation.

Well, there are some slang terms and such but these are largely frowned upon. 'Outlaw' is one of these. 1% is a term embraced and worn proudly on the colors of some M/Cs. Its not offensive at all to refer to a patch holder as a 1%er so long as he does infact display it on his colors. For the record, not all M/Cs are 1%er organizations but I suspect most here already know this.

There are obvious groups that have reputations that are infamous but are there factions within those groups that say... are more open minded than others?

Each club is different and I'm only giving a generalization based on what I know. I'd have to ask, open minded in what way? or could you give me an example perhaps?


BadgerOctane

[Ammoman]

Each club is different and I'm only giving a generalization based on what I know. I'd have to ask, open minded in what way? or could you give me an example perhaps?
BadgerOctane

That was probably not what I should have asked. It seems to me that a club, group, fraternity etc are just people with a common goal, bond, ethics or even spirituality. If they are not understood they are less than socially desirable in the eyes of the observer (as a rule of thumb).

Is your group as a whole condescending of other groups just because they are different. Is is territorial, tribal like or just proud of it's local heritage and a closed society to protect the group from harm or protect a mystic.

I am amazed how as a young man I was an considered an outcast of society, and was openly condemned and my family suffered with my decisions and actions. I found however, myself isolated even within my own group because I had more of a conscience and this drove me away to find my own path. I consider myself open minded but as maturity set in and my instinct to protect the ones I love, family, children etc took over, I took on a more acceptable persona to give what I thought my children should be grounded in. 20 years in the military provided a basis but I've even felt outcast by my association in that group when placed outside its confines. Now as a return rider after 30 years away, I find myself lost in the mixture of groups and wonder what it all has in store for me.

Am I now, in the eyes of some less than I was, probably. I don't feel comfortable with most of the 99%ers but don't think I would be with the 1%ers either. There is a place for me however in that I am what I have always been, free to choose my place and accepting of all that will share a common belief. That freedom on 2 wheels is what make us complete.

Oooops, off your topic. I guess these are sort of my colors, though not displayed.

[gonzo]

I think Ammoman raises a real good point about "joining in" or "being made to feel welcome" As with everything else in life, from the childhood playground to our current work situations, WE HAVE TO BE INVITED IN. Start a new job, you (hopefully) watch a while to see the "pecking order" You wait to be invited in. You get transferred to a new military post, there will be a hierarchical structure in place, (even among people of the same rank) I too have been part of the "outside, looking in" I will never forget the first time I saw a KZ900 (1978), we pulled up at a stop light beside each other, I was on a Triumph Bonneville 750, the guy laughed at me, I slid in behind him, followed him for a while, we pulled in to a Hardee's lot where there were a BUNCH of Kawasaki's hanging out, I was made to feel REAL unwelcome, REAL FAST, kick started my thumper and rolled on out. I did find a group that welcomed me, rode with them for a while. As it turned out, they found me !! I was at work washing my bike during lunch, guy stopped, introduced himself and we talked for about 1/2 hour. He had seen me at a local hangout, invited me to ride with them. They wore colors and I realized rather quickly, what a neat feeling to be among a group. It was made known to me that I would not be able to be a member, but I was welcome to ride anytime they got together (and did for a while) My suggestion, Ammoman...put yourself out there, most bike shops have information about ride groups, yes even some of the ones that Badger refers to, WAIT to be invited to follow and wait your turn to speak. Ride groups as with motorcycles, there are a bunch of different ones...mainly because people are different. I wear colors to signify my affiliation and we spend a lot of time talking to people..and inviting them to ride with us. It is kinda funny that kids and wives and mother-in-laws and houses and hospitalization and 401k's and SS issues change us...and soften us in ways that we never expected or anticipated. I would like to say thanks to Badger for sharing his soul with us "thanks.. Badger !!" the info that you have shared is so worthwhile and timely...it seems to be getting easier to get into "rival territory" without ever being aware and the advice about "respect" , WOW...hit the nail on the head. (been watching this thread since it started, waited my turn to jump in!!) (thought about saying something that I THOUGHT was funny, changed my mind...)
Anyway...wasted enuff electrons here, I am not sure my advice is as valuable as Badger's, BUT, Ammoman, if I can help..email me?? Badger, I still stand in awe...

gonzo

[Ammoman]

Gonzo,
Good to hear from you. When the weather turns for the better and the season starts I will see what the local groups offer. Not an ideal time of year to get affiliated but it's comming soon.

Thanks for your advice.

Badger, Thanks for your candid responses so far.

I really appreciate you, this group and most folks I have met so far. This is going to be a great year!

[BadgerOctane]

And thank you guys. :)

Basically the invite issue is a definite, and seems to be quite similar with many groups not strictly 1%ers. Usually a group wants to get to know someone a little and then figure out if they would perhaps be a good candidate for 'Prospecting'. Prospecting is a 2 way street so to speak, its a trial period really. It means that you haven't earned your full priviledges in the group, but you still have many benefits from the group. Prospecting can take as little as a year, or as long as several years, and its up to the officers to decide if you're ready to join.

As far as outcasts go, there are even those within a group that are on the borderline or at least seem to be in a league of their own in some small context. Actually I happen to be a prime example of that myself. When I have an opinion I express it, and can somehow usually find a way to speak the words so I can express an agreeance or disagreeance without really offending. On the adverse side to that, I'm still known as quite a scrapper. Hence I get the nick name Badger not only because its the type of airbrush I favor, but its also because in my past I was quite a fighter. Some would say I almost lived for it, and I'd fight anyone really. Size, strength, none of that mattered and I've been told its intimidating to see a 6'4" 300+ lbs guy convulsing on the ground because he was attacked by a 5'8" guy tipping the scales at 160. It wasn't my fighting skill that got me in, in fact that skill almost got me ejected.

It was my mind, the way I think largely, and of course painting and art had a great deal to do with it. Fortunately I've wisened up over the years a bit and come to realize that fighting isn't usually necessary. People can disagree and life goes on. I thank the old bros for teaching me this.


BadgerOctane

[gixster92]

Ok I feel I watched long enough, being that I took a part in the discussion on the other board, I thought I let others have a time to speak here, but I can't wait any more. You brought up that you got your nick from your survival tactics and your preferred gun (airbrush that is). Do member normally get a new nick when they become a M/C? Do they get it during the prospecting phase? I am not asking for particulars, but what are some of the better nicks if you can reveal that.

[BadgerOctane]

Good question Gix. Nicknames are just something that is given by your closest of bros and like everything else it spreads around quickly. Of course sometimes a member already has a nickname beforehand and if its fitting it usually sticks. A guy can get a nickname at just about any time, and its usually something that never changes. Nicknames aren't mandatory mind you, but they are actually helpful. I'll put it this way, Chris is a very common name, so by calling me Badger there is no question which Chris is being refered to.

The nickname I use here is a two part nickname. Octane was given to me by the racing buddies, and Badger by the bros, so I just combine them in forums so when I go to racing sites there's no confusion there either. :)

Some nicknames I've heard, and not necessarily with guys who are affiliated, but just names in general are Two Toes, Six-Trips, Carver, Shakes, Rip, Peach, Dago, Ram, and Clutch. Some nicks are kind of humorous, some make no sense but to a select few, and others are by reputation. Its a bro thing really. Although it brings me to a good point.

When meeting a 1%er whatever name he introduces himself by is the name you should refer to him when in public. Usually its his birth name. If you hear his buddies call him by his nickname, it doesn't mean you can. This is a respect issue really. If you overhear his nickname and are curious, you can ask him, just don't make a public display of it. Personally I introduce myself by my name and nickname, but that's just me.

Also the term 'Bro'. Now this one is a little loose and kind of overlooked, but generally its not favored. His brothers have earned the right to call him a bro, a non patch hasn't. This term has run its course though in common tongue really so its largely overlooked but its good knowledge to have.

Touching colors. This is a definite No-No. Even if you're really friendly with a 1%er, please don't touch his colors. Maybe he wouldn't think much of it, but his brothers certainly would. This is considered disrespectful. A simple gesture of patting a guy on a back because he's your friend and things are cool could be considered offensive if he's wearing his colors.

So there's a few extras. I'll see what other questions come about. :)

BadgerOctane

[Suty]

Badger, Thanks for the info ,I am sure all of us have learned a little something from it. I belong to a MC here in the Dallas are, it is a National Club with Chapters overseas. We are more of a "Mom and Pop" MC than many of the National and Regional MC's around here. We are all Firefighters and enjoy the road and our bros. Our MC enjoys a great relationship with the local "1%ers" we attend and support them when we can and they do the same for us. At first when we started wearing our Colors, we were stopped and asked about our Club and it's "intentions" in the Dallas area. Once they understood who we were and what we were about, we all had a beer and got to know one another. I just wanted to add my 2 cents, if your ever in Dallas look me up. Bros, Suty

[Biker Babe]

First, thank you Badger for shring so much knowledge and insight. Topics like this and people like you are what helps to make this a great board. :thumbup:

OK, now I'm going to use my teacher rule that there are no dumb questions and hope that is correct, if not please let me know. :crazy:

I keep seeing you mention about remaining vague on details. I understand that here this is to teach a broad theory on the M/C, but it seems to me to a bit stronger ideal than just that with as many times as it has been mentioned.

My question is why? and why not ask anything beyond a very vague or generalizable question? Is it a matter of respect? that its not anyone else's business? to help maintain security? to protect the mystery? etc?

Your point about not doing it is well stated, I'm just curious about where it comes from. :angel:

Thanks!

[BadgerOctane]

Thanks Suty. :)

Actually Suty just reminded me of an issue I'll likely get into a little later on. Territory. Remember when I mentioned 'Club A, B, & C'? Those guys have their respective territory and anyone wearing a form of colors in that territory is largely asked by the resident M/C about this club's intentions in this territory. Because honestly a group of upstarts can make a resident M/C look bad. So that's why his group was questioned, as he can likely say it was no big issue and everything went really well.

Biker Babe wrote:I keep seeing you mention about remaining vague on details. I understand that here this is to teach a broad theory on the M/C, but it seems to me to a bit stronger ideal than just that with as many times as it has been mentioned.

My question is why? and why not ask anything beyond a very vague or generalizable question? Is it a matter of respect? that its not anyone else's business? to help maintain security? to protect the mystery? etc?


Securtiy certainly is one big priority with this. But there are many factors really. Largely respect is an issue not just for the club but its members. I can divulge personal information about myself just as anyone really can, but to divulge information about another person is very disrespectful. This is more of a moral issue I think and not simply restrictive to clubs. Also, its no big secret that the law doesn't particularly favor 1%ers and it could be said that they are a target of the law. So by giving a member's name I could be putting the eyes of the law on him. True perhaps this member has nothing to hide because he abides by the law, but honestly, who wants to be watched?

As far as direct questions, people can certainly ask them I guess, but there are questions which I won't answer because they might be disrespectful, or simply unnecessary to answer. Plainly they are of no one's business really. I welcome direct questions, but as I've stated there might be some I can't or won't answer. Another reason I'd like to be vague on club names however is because of forum participation. I don't want this forum to lose members because someone here belongs to the _______ 1%er M/C. In a sense this forum is treated much like house rules. In order to participate here, members must abide by the rules, and basically I feel that name dropping of clubs would only deter people or create unnecessary tensions here. So for the vague aspect its more or less a favor in some senses. Another aspect to this is the issue of false or misleading information. I can't honestly say what another M/C does for certain, even though I'm friendly with a couple others. I hope this makes sense.

If use of club name is necessary, I would expect to see it in the form of histortical context. In that context its acceptible. Perfect case would be Hollister when the Booze Fighters made some headlines for having a good time. For the record the Booze Fighters are not a 1%er group, but I believe they are still an active M/C.

Another would be the issue of the Rolling Stones and the H.A.s. This is acceptible name dropping. Other acceptible name dropping would include organizations such as Suty's Firefighters, Police or LE, Veterans of war M/Cs, Christian ride groups and things of that nature.

Its perhaps best not to cite names of M/Cs 1%er or not on a casual basis for the simple sake of forum outlook. To gain members here, its perhaps best to largely be an unbiased forum. So someone doesn't misinterpret this forum's intentions. In a sense its respect for CycleChat, and the house rule. :)

I would like to say, that if I've answered something and it still seems unclear, do let me know so I can try to communicate it better. The colors thread in the other forum went so well I've started getting what I call 'fan mail' hehehe. People who drop me a line for simply sharing on what was an enigma for them. Basically I put many fears to rest and that makes me feel pretty good, because that's the whole point of this. You don't have to fear what you don't understand but its perhaps best to learn how to live with it, and even learn to become comfortable. Many people don't agree with the lifestyle of the 1%er, but many do associate and even share a friendship with some of us. I guess another context I could put that in would be something such as the Shriners. An organization many of us are uninterested in participating in, but a group that is easily spoken to and associated with as well.


BadgerOctane

[Ammoman]

Quoting Badger: "Many people don't agree with the lifestyle of the 1%er, but many do associate and even share a friendship with some of us."

What does the lifestyle consist of?

Is there a common thread to the hierarchy?

[gixster92]

I am sure there are members here that belong to a Local Hog chapter or two. Now I see some of these members (hog chapters) that have the look and feel of a 1%er to a certain degree (I am stereotype the look from movies). They have their rockers, their designation patch. How do 1%ers view these organizations, do any 1%er you know part of a HOG chapter? Can a 1%er join any other motorcycle organization of is the forbidded or frowned upon? Granted I assume this is club by club baises. Do 1%ers take in any activities (rides and such) that is thrown by other organizations? And how are you received by the organization running the Ride/event?

[Suty]

Gix and Ammo, Badger is the expert when it comes to this subject, but let me give you some info I know. Most if not all M/C's have a Heirarchy even HOG has one. Most M/C's have club officers, President, Vice- Pres, Sgt@ Arms etc.. beyond that you have the Members and Prospects. The lowest position would be Prospect ,from which once you are voted in or asked to join, you become a member. As far as the 1%er Lifestyle I will defer that to Badger, I can say that all my dealings with our local 1%er's have been good. I don't pretend to know the goings on in their M/C's I can just base my opinons on how I have been treated at there Club Houses and functions. As far as Colors go , our Club has a place for the colors on our vests or jackets. Colors will go on the back in a spot specified by National, the Rocker will go underneath that. Our Rocker was looked at and ok'd by the locals, we could not have Texas anywhere on it ( That goes to the turf thing ). On the front all Club patches go on the left side ( over your heart). Other than that we can put other patches where we want. I for instance ,have my Military patches on the right side ( 2nd CAV and Airborne ). I cannot be a member of another Club nor display any other Club's colors on my vest. I can be a Supporter , but that might lead to issues when meeting with the locals so I stay neutral. As far as attending Rallys and Benefits, I see the locals at some but not at others. We are haveing a Burn Camp Run on May 8th, we've been told that some of the locals will attend. We try to attend when they have functions to show our support, however, sometimes we have to stay away do to nature of some 1%er functions. I hope this has helped in some way. We here enjoy a good relationship with our Locals and I hope to keep that going for years to come. Tu Compadre, Suty

[BadgerOctane]

Thumbs up to Suty, M/Cs and 1%er M/Cs have much in common sometimes and Suty did a great job explaining that one. :)

Overall the lifestyle consists of a brotherhood that is supportive and looks after its own. This brotherhood will often also look out for the community of the residing territory. This is why toy runs and such are common place.

Suty described the heirarchy quite well. Within a chapter you have Pres., Vice., Treasurer, Secretary, Sgt. at Arms, and Road Captains. In the 1%er M/C you may also see Sentinels, WarLords, Nomads, etc. This might also be the same with a standard M/C perhaps.

Things like HOG and ABATE are certainly not frowned upon by us. And in fact when it comes to issues reguarding the laws around motorcycles in general, (i.e. helmet laws, noise restrictions, etc.) HOG and ABATE are really good at contacting the officers in order to inquire about the issue and seek some more numbers for possible voting. As a 1%er you do not join any other organization, though you might be welcome at another organization's events, including another 1%er. This is done by way of invite and through the proper chain of command. A certain protocol is always upheld.

Another thing I'd like to mention real quick is something that Suty brought up. He's in a slightly unique situation being in Texas. Its very true that you will only see one group if any at all, wear a rocker that reads Texas. And from what I've been told not even law enforcement clubs wear it. I happen to have several Texan 1%er friends who travel through CO. on occasion and I do not recall seeing Texas on their rockers even though they belong to the largest and most dominant M/C in the state of Texas. Next time I see them I'll look but I did learn this one long ago.

Basically when starting an M/C there is a certain code of conduct you will be expected to uphold and present. Contrary to what people believe, the 1%er lifestyle is very organized in the sense that regular meetings are scheduled and attended. Sometimes there are mass meetings where you'll find rival clubs in the same room and yet the meeting goes smoothly because rank is witnessed and adhered. A certain parlimentary proceedure is in order at the meetings. An item, (discussion) is brought to the table, (attention of the room) and motions, (decisions) are made on that item. There must be a second,(agree) on the motion before that topic will continue. This can happen with things such as deciding if a prospect patches out, if a club is to attend a certain function or event, and many other things.


BadgerOctane

[gixster92]

Okay since now one else has had the chance to ask other questions... I want to lighten this up a tad...

If you have wasted your time watching "Biker Boyz"... how bad were you laughing at their perception of 1%er's? The movie was horrible and don't recommend anyone to see it. However after going thru this thread on the other board and had the insight Badger gave me... I found that movie to be HORRIBLY bad. I can only imagine a 1%er watching that movie like I watch movies that talk computer stuff. Hollywood has a way to message the truth of things.

[BadgerOctane]

I've been waiting for someone to bring up the movie issue Gix. :tongue: As I read your post I had to crack my fingers and rub my hands together hehehe.

Movies, a.k.a. Mediated Reality.

Sure the news puts a spin on things to make them seem larger than they really are, this much I'm sure we all know and have seen. But Hollywood has a major impact on this kind of thing. The news we watch tries to utilize some of the same drama and b.s. that we see in the movies, and it makes sense. I mean the news tries to keep our attention because after all whatever channel has the best news, is the one we watch. That means ratings go up, salaries are getting paid, etc. On the subject of mediated reality, anyone who has been in the military or worked for the gov't can likely tell you all about this one.

As far as biker movies I really liked, Easy Rider was a good flick. Sure there was some Hollywood in it, but overall it was just a pretty cool movie. This was based moreso on characterization though than anything else in my opinion. There was a movie with Charlie Sheen and if I'm not mistaken the title was Beyond the Law Now I'm not saying that Hollywood didn't have their grubby mits in this one, but I will admit that I could see where they at least did a little homework here and there. This movie was based on a true story they say and then of course they fleshed it out here and there so it would be entertaining.

In all honesty even if I were to make a movie on the subject I doubt anyone would really watch it. There's not a whole lot of drama or anything really 'exciting' I guess. It would be more like just a documentary and let's face it, action movies do better at the box office than documentaries.

I have had the misforutune of watching Biker Boyz. First I'd like to add, there are in fact sportbike M/Cs for anyone who didn't know. As for the movie itself, I give it 2 thumbs way down and a limp..... well, you get the idea, it was a lousy movie. But let me break it down a little.

Facts or close truths shown in Biker Boyz:
1. Prospects will sometimes do stupid or silly things in an attempt to gain recognition.
2. The council scene in the movie where the main character is stating he wants to create his own M/C. Some close truth here, a meeting would be called, rivals might be present however there is much more order to it than what the movie portrayed. But it would be voted upon.
3. They showed a bike wash. This is but one type of event held by M/Cs to raise money for a cause and peak club interest from potentials.

Now, the total B.S. shown in that movie:
1. These guys live for racing betting lots of money at a time. Races are not uncommon at all, however there is a sponsored racer, its not usually the Pres.
2. Display of colors in the movie was very poor in my opinion. Very few actually displayed anything even remotely close to typical worldwide accepted colors.
3. The scene where Kid Rock crosses the centerline at the race track.... Don't even get me started here. YES you can lose your driving priviledges by state laws in most states for intentional things like this. Accidents happen, and when a racer crosses the centerline, he's automatically disqualified no matter what his time on that run. Intentional crossing like that can and will get you expelled from many NHRA and IHRA tracks. For those wondering, I believe that was Pomona Raceway in CA.

Ok there's my rant on that one hehehe. Biker Boyz, very poor movie if you haven't seen it, don't waste your time. On the other hand if you're looking for a prime example of how 1%er ARE NOT, then watch it and laugh like many of us have. I've seen many poorly written biker movies actually. Stone cold, with Brian Bozworth.... of all the crappy movies he could have chosen to make a buck playing lead in, he perhaps should have passed this one up. The other night I caught part of one with Lou Diamond Phillips.... that one bit. How about Another 48 Hours with Eddie Murphy? Ok, the movie was good but those weren't 1%ers.

Bikers are easily portrayed villians in movies. Sure it stems from early history and what I've mentioned with the AMA, and I can't say there are not recent accounts in the news and such, but again mediated reality. They take 10% truth, and flesh the rest out for a better story. "A member of the _____ M/C was arrested today on drug charges...." Guess what, he got popped for having a couple joints on him. He'll go to court, get some community service, maybe see a night or two of 4 walls and its a blemish on his record for a while. But would that have made a good story? Would you really have watched the news if they said, "A man was arrested for having 2 marijuana cigarettes in his possesion."? Of course not, you'd likely say.... "So?" And ratings would drop, and salaries would be at risk of not being met, and the sad truth would be that truly, nothing really eventful happened and even the weather wasn't all that exciting that day.


BadgerOctane

[BadgerOctane]

I sense this one coming so I'm going to go ahead and bring it up since I kind of touched on it above.

"Badger would you like to discuss the drug problems related to 1%er M/Cs?" (Ok, I asked but I knew someone else would.) :)

Yes, I'll talk about that. Again much of this is mediated reality. I won't lie and say it was all fabricated, I won't mislead you and say that meth operations and pot farms haven't been busted and many members have faced severe charges on these things, but again there was some mediated reality in it. Do all 1% clubs participate in illegal drug use or distribution? Not at all. Would it surprise you that there are 1%er M/Cs that have a 'no substance abuse' clause? And some of these actually regulate the use of alcohol? Its true.

Many clubs have such laws and regs specifically in regards to heroin. Other's have extended it to include several drugs. If you're caught using, or distributing you will be stripped of your colors and sent on your way. So drug issues have been addressed by many M/Cs.

I can speak for myself personally, the only drug I partake in is the consuption of alcoholic beverages several times a week. I have tried other recreational drugs when I was in high school but again that's included in the section of my past I've included in changing. None of these activities were because or as a result of being active with a 1%er M/C. These were my own decisions and truth be known many of these were frowned upon by the bros and it was the bros that helped straighten me out. So I'll drink. I wouldn't say I drink anymore than the next man. I don't drink while I work because I'm kind of a perfectionist when it comes to painting and I always want to create to the best of my abilities. :) After work, I'll have a couple beers with the bros, or close friends. Watch some football or hockey in an evening and perhaps have a couple. But again, no more than the next guy I guess. I'm sure many of us can relate to this kind though.

BadgerOctane

[Suty]

Badger, Check your private message box. Suty

[BadgerOctane]

:beerchug: Got it, thanks Suty.


BadgerOctane

[Ammoman]

Badger, As for drug use, it sounds no worse than another other activity, Sheesh a frat is probably worse.

[Dyna Jim]

Ok so Badger, since we are talking about mediated reality, and movies like the one with stone cold. If this is all BS, does this mean each M/C doesn't have a herd of hot chicks they keep in the club house just for members?

If this is mediated reality as well, maybe I want to keep that vail over my eyes.....

[Lelliebabe]

As a woman, I'm gonna throw in my .02...hope no one minds, 'specially since I've been MIA for a little while...(busy moving)...

When I lived in SW FL a few years back, I was invited into our local M/C to mix & ride...not JOIN, just to hang out...and with open arms, I might add...NO...not THAT way...just as a friend...they were a fairly new club & maybe they were a tad more lenient in their rules since they WERE just getting up & running, I don't know...but on the road, they looked after me, probably because back then, not many women rode their own...

On the flip side of the coin, up here in PA, I've said 'Hello' to a member of another well-known M/C, only to be thrown a sharp-tongued reply...something about women shouldn't speak...Go figure.............


:angel:

[gixster92]

Lelliebabe, good to see you are back online, and I hope your move went well.

I will say a piece to this... I am sure Badger/Suty will to, but I don't think that the a-hole that sharped tongue you had any relation to him being in a M/C. To me it is just that his mom mistreated him as a kid and for that he has become the a-hole as he is. I am not saying that all 1%er are like badger (respectful) but I don't think being a 1%er turns you into an a-hole that is just that persons perception on life. Tell me where he is and I will give him a wake up call for you :)

[Lelliebabe]

I'm sure glad you 'got my back', Boyfriend! LOL
He didn't ruffle my feathers at all...I figgered the same as you...
The funnny part is, I've prob'ly been ridin' way longer than him...not that that means anything, ya know? :angel:
I believe ALL bikers should give...and deserve in return...RESPECT...this 'gender thang' don't make no sense!
hehehe

FYI...didn't move yet...been busy with house-hunting, realtors, pricing moving companies, etc...flying down to AMI on the 15th to see what I can find to buy...wish me luck!

[BadgerOctane]

Ammoman brought up the point of fraternity, and although I haven't been in a frat myself even though I went to college, I have heard this before so I think that possibly there are some similarities to it.

DJ asked: does this mean each M/C doesn't have a herd of hot chicks they keep in the club house just for members?

Although there are some very fine looking women that are often around the M/C each one is spoken for. hehehe. I wish we had a horde of hot chicks hehehe. A bro can bring his SO to many functions and then there are some for patchers only. I should add that in some M/Cs you can find patched women and even women officers, but largely it is a male dominated area.

This also kind of ties in with Lelliebabe's comments. Some clubs have an idea that women should be seen and not heard, and that's their opinion, and also I think Gix's thoughts on that are right on too. Personally I try to be friendly to any and all who are friendly with me. :)

BadgerOctane

[Ammoman]

I think you all are right that the kid was just brought up wrong. If he didn't respect Lelliebabe, there probably aren't many things he does respect. He hopefully will get some guidance from soemone he looks up to and grows up like most of us have.

BTW Lelliebabe, why are you moving?

[Lelliebabe]

I think you all are right that the kid was just brought up wrong. If he didn't respect Lelliebabe, there probably aren't many things he does respect. He hopefully will get some guidance from soemone he looks up to and grows up like most of us have.

BTW Lelliebabe, why are you moving?

Can you say R E T I R I N G?????? LOL
I used to live on AMI for about 16 years...always wanted to move back down there...love the Gulf, the white sand, the 25 mph speed limit on the island (LMAO) and being able to ride jes about 360 days a year!
Plus...most of my good friends live there and I miss'm! :mecry:
I'm chompin at the bit, I tell ya! :smokin:

[gixster92]

badger you wrote "and then there are some for patchers only" are you referring to women here hehehehehe ok I know it is functions but hey it sounds pretty good if you mess with the context.

[BadgerOctane]

Hehehe, what I mean is a bro is usually allowed to bring his SO along with him to most of the events. However at some meetings she wouldn't be allowed to attend, strictly patch business then. In clubs where women are allowed to patch out though this is different of course. Then you would see a women attending meetings.

When multi club meetings take place, any women patchers understand that some patch holders of other clubs might not speak to her. Such is the way it is really. I don't know if this would ever change in the future, but I should say that the women do have a pretty good presense at some of the meetings. I've seen them co-ordinate large buffet style meals for us, (my favorite part of course.) some of them have also gotten really good at selling the support gear. Its an honest fact that a guy would rather buy a t-shirt from a pretty girl rather than an intimidating looking bro. hehehe. But an officer is always present still to handle any questions, donations and such.

BadgerOctane

[fatboymil]

Hey Badger, I just saw a question on another forum that made me wonder the same thing. What patches can be worn by non club members so as not to offend or cause problems. I've got some HD patches, Fatboy, Eagle and fllag, HOG etc. are there certain patches that are not to be worn, other than specific club patches, and is placement important?
Thanks.
Fatboymil

[OldCutlass]

Hey guys,

Thanks.

This has been one of the most insightful and informative threads I have ever read anywhere, anytime in my life, and it was written by a bunch of "bikers". Go figure.

Seriously. Thank you.

Peace.
O.C.

[Maalox]

Badger,

What do the other patch holders in your M/C think about you sharing this information with us? Are they supportive or would some of the members prefer to keep the mystique that surrounds the 1% M/C clubs?

Thanks

[BadgerOctane]

Fatboymil,

Wearing anything that resembles 'colors' could bring some questions your way, but for the most part its usually easy to see when someone just has a vest designated for various patches and they're not exactly affiliated. Patches that might get some questions coming your way would be support gear of anykind, 1%er patches, names of M/Cs even non 1%ers, etc. Typically anything resembling a 3 piece patch set up might be grounds for some questioning. Otherwise as long as it wasn't in direct offense you'd probably be ok. Also patches displaying the S.S. bolts, (which are actually tattooed on my arm) or swastika could (but not always) bring some questions. The Maltese Cross has become widely acceptible and usually is associated with choppers so those are fine too.

Maalox,

As long as I don't give out specific information about members, number of members, locations, another's personal info, etc. The content in this thread is basically info that if asked for honestly would be given anyway. Usually people don't take the time to ask so the only mystique is actually created by those who never ask and merely draw assumptions based on things they've read, 'stories' fact or fiction, and other mediated sources. Naturally to say that all 1%ers are nice, kind, and polite people perhaps isn't true, however it could be said that more than half are willing to answer a good honest question for the sake of educating a curiousity. So basically if I say that I can't or won't answer something, its a question that I know I could get in trouble for answering. :)

BadgerOctane

[Wind]

Badger,
How about the other side of the story? You have said how much of the time its just bike riders in a club, no different from the Shriners. We have all heard how bad biker clubs, especially the 1%ers type, can be. So far you have been very informative and it has been a great learning experience for us. But what about what we see in the papers and hear on the news? Drugs, guns, fights, rival gangs, criminal offences, what happened at Laughlin, Sonny Barger & the Hells Angels, 2 year FBI investigations, and the rest of it. Its not all media hype, is it?
Without being specific, what is it you can't tell us? How did you come to get gun and stab wounds? Why do you wear the SS tatoo?
You tell us about charity toys for tots runs, but what else is there? If not in your club then others.

[BadgerOctane]

Alright... Wind has come out with the heavy hitter questions hehehe.

The other side of it... Well its true that some members have recreational activities, hobbies, habits or whatever you'd like to call it that are not deemed legal in the eyes of the law. To say that each and every 1%er is a part of that however is simply not true. Personally the only drug I do anymore is alcohol. I don't touch anything else, I don't even want to be around it, therefore I'm not tempted to fall back into my own ways. So like mentioned earlier in this thread, sure you'll see a guy get busted for drugs... but what you have to ask is was he busted for something big, or something not so big? That's the untold story. So while I'm not saying everyone should completely disregard the media, simply ask questions of that media is all. Fights, rivalries, etc. It starts with a little truth, and often seems larger than life. The media isn't lying, merely capitolizing to make it seem like a larger story than it really is.

I can't reveal any specifics of course. Names, places, and such to my particular M/C, because that's a direct violation of my colors. And by choice, I choose not to publically announce my colors, because this is an unbiased forum and rightly it should be. I don't want another member to leave because of my affiliations. Likewise I don't want to draw the wrong crowd either, so by keeping that under my hat, its just more professional and respectable that way.

Ironically the bullet holes and stab wounds came before I ever patched out. The bros were the ones who helped me start on the path I am now. They cleaned me up and really helped me get where I am today. I wear the S.S. tattoo by choice as a sign of pride, respect, and gratitude to those bros. Sadly some of those that were closest in helping me make these changes are no longer on this Earth. They're reserving me a stool at the great clubhouse beyond and one of these years I'll join them. And hopefully I'll have made somekind of impact on someone else and they'll be looking up at me, asking me to reserve a stool for them as well. And that I shall.

M/Cs are actually a community effort. They truely are there to help the community. Toy runs, bike washes, bike rodeos, etc. all help raise money for various causes. Many times a small percentage goes to those bros who chipped in so they break even at least, and are able to continue with future events. Normally these functions are small and for two reasons. Sometimes it is affiliates only, but many times people don't seem to see the 'Open to the Public' words on banners, bilboards, flyers, etc. They only see the, _______ M/C. And immediately draw conclusions that they wouldn't be welcome or that its a place were trouble will occur.

Now Sonny Barger is a whole different issue. Personally I've never read any of his books, and I honestly have no intention of doing so. I know people who have read them and even met the man and they've told me that many of the questions I've answered were found to be quite similar to the experiences of Mr. Barger. And then there are some obvious differences as well seeing as how he's an entirely different affiliation with different notoriety. If Mr. Barger prefers to make money from having his books published on information that can simply be asked for, that is his decision and so be it. Personally if I were going to make a profit from writting anything I'd rather it be a step by step how to on things I've come to learn custom paint and build wise. That's just me though.

Excellent questions though Wind. I thank you for asking those because largely those are questions people want to ask but are either afraid or simply feel it disrespectful to ask. There was no disrespect in your words there at all, and hopefully I've answered your questions in a thorough manner. I'd like to add that if anyone has a question that seems disrespectful or such, simply try to word it in a way you feel isn't as negative in conotation. If in fact it is something I can't answer, I'll let you all know. :)

Take care, ride safe and if you have a question, you know where to ask. Night for now everyone.

BadgerOctane

[Maalox]

Thanks Badger

[NCFatBoy]

Badger,

Some of the attributes of the M/C definition that you have provided resemble what is also stereotypical of gangs. Merriam-Webster defines as "a group of persons working to unlawful or antisocial ends; especially : a band of antisocial adolescents".

Not all of the attributes are stereotyped, some which you have mentioned certainly are, but rivalries and turfs seem to be obvious and common to both. You mention media sensationalization is the cause of much of the misconceptions and certainly motorcycle clubs have been referred to (by media) as "gangs".

While you have explained in depth the importance of respect within the M/C world, much of the negative implications associated with M/C come from the consequences that are a result of disrespect. This seems to be where the fear/uncertainty originates. The retribution of M/C to individual's or other another M/C that disrespects them is the attribute that may not be socially acceptable or for that matter lawful.

While I can appreciate all the good that M/C do, even the good folks in M/Cs end up guilty by association with the bad. But that is true with many "groups".

No disrespect intended :) ... but as one of the most important attributes with regards to the negative connotations of M/C, can you post a few words regarding retribution for disrespect and how M/C are or are not "gangs"?

Thanks for your posts, they are interesting and informative..... I spent a while thinking before clicking the button to post this... :)

[BadgerOctane]

Well, just by definition it sounds like a gang works toward the common goal of illegal activity, or anti-social behavior. While I can't speak for all the M/Cs in the world, I can clearly say that illegal activity is not the basis in several 1%er M/Cs I know quite well. In fact the dominant factor is usually in regards to various motorcycle related legislature. Things like helmet laws, loud pipes, even environmental concerns such as going from air to watercooled engines and such. Basically the term "Live to ride, ride to live" is especially true in these cases. So personally I feel there is a huge difference between an M/C and a gang. However, if Webster decided to change the definition to include us, well I guess I'd just have to live with it hehehe. :)

Retribution for disrespect:

This is a broad range really. I mean some disrespect is actually protected by law and the American judicial system sometimes sees 1%er M/Cs as a plaintiff in a case rather than a defendant. Court battles happen, and that is why its not surprising to see an attorney that is affiliated with an M/C. Also I think its important to say, that should a brother be arrested and placed in gen. pop., his clothes are kept in the prison storage like anyone else, with the exception of his colors. His colors are returned to his M/C, because law enforcement officials have been sued over such a thing and its just less hassle to return the colors then go through tedious litigation. So there's one side of it, but you were probably expecting something along the lines of this....

Fights can happen unfortunately. But when you think about it, this can happen with anyone. Naturally if you and your buddies go out somewhere and someone is causing trouble, your buddies will likely stand by your side and offer support right? (One would hope I guess.) Well the same thing happens with us. However as far as the 'guilty by association' term goes this is very true. If you and your buddies get into somekind of scuffle at the local watering hole, you might get tossed out, you might actually go to jail, etc. But when one of us do, it becomes news at 10. Notoriety has a bit to do with it in this aspect.

I'd like it to be said, that largely violence isn't really smiled upon. If there is a better means and peace can be kept, that is always sought for first. If there is clearly no other way, then you do what you've got to do.

The thing about being involved is the whole support issue. Even if your brother makes a poor decision, you still support him. You don't have to like his actions, but you do have to accept whatever choice he made and show him that you'll be there with him through it all. You can tell him, "Well bro, you screwed up good, but I'm here for ya." and this just goes with the patch really. You stick with your brothers through thick and thin, hell or highwater basically. You look out for each other, and in return they watch out for you. If a brother should depart this earth, its our job to make sure his family is going to be alright in his absense. If a brother brings the proud news that he and his SO have an added member to their family, then its our job to make sure that new little mouth never goes hungry. We do this, because our brothers would do the same for us. We do look at the outside world with eyes of distrust because really, everyone is out for themselves. There's nothing entirely wrong with that, its just Darwinism in effect is all. "The strong will survive." We simply find strength in numbers.

Call us a clan, an elite organization, affiliation, a group, but to us, we are brothers one and all. No one else will look after us, so we'll look after each other. :)

BadgerOctane

[BadgerOctane]

"I am my brother's keeper." Some of you may have heard this phrase before. What does it mean exactly? Well imagine this, if everyone around you has this kind of mindset, you're both a helping hand to aid others, and you have a helping hand to aid you, should you need one. This can apply everywhere in life really, and with it comes and is offered a simple thing: Respect.

I'm trying to think of other things I can help everyone understand, and I remember I was asked about the above saying in a private message before so I figured I'd mention it here too. Here's a couple other questions I was asked in a PM, and by the way, if anyone is nervous or doesn't really want to display your question here on the boards, you can send me a PM. I'll answer it to the best of my ability, but again, I won't be giving specific details, and such, I'll just answer your questions in general. :)

"What if I pull up to some place and 1%ers have their bikes parked out front?" This is an easy one. If you want to go into this place, by all means go. If they're parked out front and thats where bike parking is, park. You don't have to segregate yourself. If they're hosting a function (open to the public) and parking is scheduled you might be directed to a parking spot, just as you would while attending some other event. They will have staff if its a large event and they are there to HELP you so that the flow of traffic will continue. Once inside and attending, just be yourself. Offer respect and it shall be given to you in return. And if you see me, say 'hi', introduce yourself, let me know who you are, and I'll probably buy you a drink of your choice, because meeting new friends is a great thing. :bounce1:

"I'm a member of a small ride group and we have jackets, what should I say if I encounter a large group and they ask me about my colors?" Well, the truth really. They're just curious and want to know what you're all about. If they have suggestions and such, just listen is all. If you're colors are somehow offensive you'll find out pretty quick. So at least be ready to justify your decisions to them. Things can be handled in a simple debate without all the drama of yelling, screaming, and otherwise looking like a fool. In fact you'll get a much better response if you conduct your business in a professional manner.

"Should I put a fork lock on my bike when I attend a 1%er function?" Well, even asking me this is sort of disrespectful. Its as if you're implying a patch holder has intentions to steal or otherwise harm your bike. If you're going to attend our function and have to worry about one of us stealing your ride, maybe it would be best if you simply didn't attend. It wouldn't be to your benefit to stand around all tense and worried about your ride because you won't be comfortable, and likely we won't be comfortable around you.

So as you can see there are a range of questions that are all good questions to ask.

Badger

[usahellas]

Thank you again Badger for all the great post and your great sense of humor. I had been posting things in your other thread and now will try to keep post applying to this topic in this thread.

I hope you do not mind but I just read something in your last post and I almost fell on the floor laughing.

"Should I put a fork lock on my bike when I attend a 1%er function?"
So the question was great, but your answer was even better. :beerchug: Now I guess I am a bit paranoid myself so I put a lock on my front fork no matter where I am. So please do not be offended when you see me lock up my bike. It is not about you but about my tick. :nut:

[usahellas]

Badger I do hope that my last comment did not upset you. I was thinking about this and I am not the kind of person who likes to upset someone.

I have read the post where you said that someone asked you about the bike lock several times now. No idea why I just did. Why did I even think about this you might ask? Well it is actually very simple. Before I read the post I had never, ever made any thought at all as to locking or not locking my bike. I have simply always locked it up and never thought about would this offend someone when I am at their function on their property. It is kind of like locking my car up when I get out or locking my house when I leave.

Maybe if he rephrased the question to: "Would it be considered an insult if I put a lock on my front fork at a 1%er function?"

Oh well I guess I am just rambling on. Strange how I can sometimes ponder over the strangest things.

[BadgerOctane]

Not upset at all usahellas. :)

Actually I can see an area where I should elaborate a little though on the fork lock.

Some people use these almost subconsciously, and probably use the Club on the steering wheel of the car just as equally. It becomes so repetitious that its standard practice to them. You can (or at least I can) notice these types right away. I personally don't take offense to this kind of nature. And its this type of action that can easily be redeemed in our eyes just by getting to know the person. But every once in a while I do see someone fishing around in the bottom of a saddlebag, then going to the other bag, scratching their head, and then coming out with a lock to put on their fork. To me, and many others this took effort, and a great deal of thought. This person was determined to find this lock, and because it wasn't right where they could get to it easily kind of suggests as if they don't usually lock this thing up, but are doing so because they're concerned about our security measures as if they don't feel we're capable of maintaining security. Still, getting to know a person can offer redemption for minor offenses.

So some of us take offense to that kind of thing. Me personally? I usually just shake my head but don't take it too much to heart. They obviously don't trust me or my brothers, so I figure this will probably be the one and only event of ours they show up at. Probably best that way too.

When the guy I mentioned above asked the question if he should put a fork lock on his bike, I got a little more offended than I usually would. It was as if he was implying that a fork lock isn't something he normally uses, but because he was attending our function he figured he needed it. However my reply could be read many different ways. The luxury we have when hearing a voice is we can understand the 'tone' behind it. I'm not a guy who likes to yell or even raise my voice really. So even when offended, upset, angry, etc. I usually speak in an even and firm tone to display it. If I'm greatly offended, then I tend to get kind of a snap and growl to these words hehehe.

My nickname was earned because of my past, when I was far more prone to aggressiveness in anger. Over the years I've tried to mellow out some as I've learned that sometimes speaking one's mind can yeild far greater effects on someone rather than just inflicting pain on them. I've learned most of my mellow and diplomatic habits from the bros themselves.

So don't worry my friend, I wasn't at all offended by your comments. Chances are, if we were to ever meet I'd probably give you a sarcastic and friendly amount of crap about it, then buy you a beer. :tongue2:

Badger

[usahellas]

Well I think we all need a healthy ragging every now and again just to keep us in line.

Now there is a saying that kids will say the darndest things and I guess having two of them running around the house makes me do the same. My wife thinks that I am freaking nuts just because I can sometimes even understand why my 3 year old does some of the stuff she does. I guess me and my 3 year old daughter just sometimes get on the same wave length. (I am not too sure who is upping their level here.) I sometimes read something and get the darndest ideas. So I guess after reading that post and then not being too happy with my answer then I had to write more. Like I have said before I am from the South and I do move a bit slower so just type slow and we will be good.

There I go doing it again. Dog gone it usahellas will say the darndest things and he loves to ramble on and on and on ........ :spank:

[usahellas]

Hey wind I know you posted the link in another thread but I just thought I should make my comment here. First of all thank you very much for the link. I seem to be upping my knowledge on motorcycle forums now. I need more hours in a day to read them all. I guess that is why here is my main hangout. :ignore:

Anyway I read the thread there at the other web site and I was able to laugh a time or so as well. I have been approached by someone from a nearby club about my vest. Yep, that Hellas rocker at the bottom looks a bit too much like a color. This was not our major club here. None of them have spoken to me about it, yet. You just never know. The last guy that asked me about it was just curious. He said are you Greek. Well as soon as I open my mouth you hear that I am not German. (that is sometimes helpful). I simply explained to him that yes, I am Greek Orthodox, my wife is Greek and my children are dual nationals. I have a few patches on my back but have tried to ensure that it is more like a bumper sticker back than a color. Only shows what I believe in and does not represent a club. I still have to get my patches from the 3d ID and 72d FA Brigade on there. Yep that is me.

I went on to explain that I was brought to my Ride Club or whatever you wish to call it "Stammtisch" by a Greek member. The only German friends that I have are in this riders club otherwise all of my friends are Greek. I enjoy the companionship of my friends in the "Stammtisch" but I am a true American / Greek at heart. That is why you also see a US and Greek Flag on my back as well as the patch where USA is written right over the Hellas. He accepted that and all was well.

[Wind]

Regarding the fork lock question. I always lock my bike. I lock my bike in my own driveway. I sometimes lock it when its in my locked garage. I lock it when I go out. I lock it in my friends driveway. Not that I am worried about my host taking my bike, but other people. I live in a very upscale suburban community where crime is not a big issue. But some people are always on the look out for a quick get a way. Something to steal and sell real quick or just a joy ride. Some kid steals it and wrecks it. No thanks.
Anyone who knows anything about the bigger Harley's knows that if the ignition isn't locked, you don't even need a key. If my security system is set you can't start it but it sure can be pushed into a truck quick enough. I have a built in fork lock, no need for a separate lock. Just a quick turn of the key and its locked. One of the better deterrants to a thief, unless he just wants to go around in circles.
My locking my bike, no matter where I am, should not be considered an insult to anyone.

[MikeB]

I have a question regarding the history of some M/C`s using the SS rune and the swastika. How was this started and is it more a personal insignia than part of club " COLORS" Thanks

[BadgerOctane]

I have a question regarding the history of some M/C`s using the SS rune and the swastika. How was this started and is it more a personal insignia than part of club " COLORS" Thanks

Great question Mike. There are some clubs in existence that favor Third Reich methodology, as well as white supremacist views. These sort of clubs here in America seem to have started in the mid '60s. Though there are clubs of this nature overseas that have been in existence since the early '50s. Those that have survived until now overseas have done so in a great deal of secrecy.

Its important to know that symbols used during the reign of Nazi Germany were actually borrowed symbols and much older than many think. These symbols do not always reflect Nazi ways at all. In fact my own religious beliefs utilize these very symbols. The swastika is translated into Norse as Mundilfari and means raw power, immoderate force, creative but violent and typically denotes a god aspect. The S or Z bolts represent the sun, a wholeness of mystic eloquence, regeneration and creativity. Hitler borrowed these symbols during the late 20s early 30s but ironically utilized their initial meanings in some cases. The swastika is a prime example of that.

I actually have SS bolts tattooed on my left arm, but to me it doesn't at all signify anything of white supremacy, Nazism or anything of the sort. Rather it has two meanings. One as stated above of wholeness of mystic eloquence, regeneration and creativity, and because its stood on end resembling a pair of sharp letter 'S', it is also recognized as the abreviation for the club I ride with. Some people place stereotypical and judgemental views on me because of this tattoo, but that only helps support my case that people are often blinded by mediated reality.

Different clubs use these to signify different things. In some cases the swastika displayed on one member's colors can mean he favors white idealism. But in other cases, (and combined with other patches) it could easily signify him of elder or high rank, and also an enforcer. Often times this symbol reflects a former enforcer. Signifying that in the absense of an enforcer this man will act accordingly if the situation calls for it.

The SS bolts are typically more relaxed to most clubs and similar to the Maltese (Iron) cross sometimes represent a lifestyle within, rather than a true meaning of some rank, form or belief.

These symbols are dying as far as some club use, and are being adopted by 'statement makers'. People who recognized the power displayed by Nazi Germany, the organization and Romanistic ideaology. To me these type of people are no more than poser wannabes just trying to stand out in a crowd.

From an outside view its not always easy to spot who's who in regards of these symbols. But maybe this can help.

If you see several club members displaying such symbols in a large and dominant form on their colors, chances are they're a white power group. You don't have to agree with their views, but unless you mess with them, they aren't likely to mess with you regardless of your color, creed, etc. We live in the new millenium now, not the racially segregated 60s.

If you see several club members displaying such symbols in the form of small patches and not a dominant form, these could mean what I stated above. A symbol of rank and display of authority.

If you see one (or at least very few) individuals wearing these or displaying them on their bike as more of a fashion sense. Chances are they're just trying to make a statement and want to be a part of something they otherwise have no chance of fitting in either.

Hopefully this helps clear that up just a little, but if there's more questions, you all know what to do. :)

Badger

[FLHT2003]

badger,

I would like to echo the statement that this is one of the best threads i've read! although i'm new here, i've been a part of other forums for awhile. this is by far one of the best boards! now to my question. i've been in law enforcement for over 16 years and have been to many rallies and gatherings. most were at myrtle. i know that the 1% M/C's dont really care for the feds, i cant really blame them, but how do they feel about local LE? or is it just a blanket policy to not like cops? i have met some while working that had a good attitude toward me, RESPECT them and they RESPECT you. is it just the punk cops that give us all a bad name? the LE brotherhood have alot in common with the MC brotherhood, just like the military brotherhood, i served in the Corps also. while at the last spring rally i almost bought a support shirt, because i do support the right for these guys to assemble and ride!
as for the illegal aspect, i'd rather hang with most 1%ers than most of the filth that we put in jail daily. 1% have pride and know about respect and order, something our youth needs to learn. i dont have much personel exposure to the 1%, these are just observations. i told my wife the other day that when i retire, i'd love to be invited to join a 1%MC. we plan to sell everything and ride til we drop! its good to hear that all the 1%MC's dont promote drug use, and illegal activity, u dont have to be a meth head and a thief to be bad. thanks for all the knowledge that you've passed on!

[BadgerOctane]

Right on FLHT, thanks for the support.

You've hit the nail right on the head with the statement that a few can often make the rest look bad. I've met some really cool LE officers, and I've met some real *insert a metaphor here* types. I think largely the view of LE in the eyes of the 1%er is often the same as some who look at 1%ers. You see them walking in your general direction and you can't help but get a sinking feeling in your gut and ask yourself, "Aw hell, are they going to mess with me, and why?" Its sort of humorous when thought of in that aspect, but sometimes that's just how you feel hehehe.

I've come to know many cops actually and they know me as well. Some I consider very good guys just doing a job that most wouldn't even vaguely understand, sometimes they have to do things they really don't want to do, its a job, I'm sure many of us can relate to that aspect. And then others always seem to have this look or idea that one day, "Badger's going to slip up and when he does, they want to be all over him like stink on a terd." hehehe. Those are the ones that won't open their minds to the fact that regardless of past, some people can and do change their ways for the better.

Still I often undergo a little excess scrutiny that many others perhaps don't receive but I think most of the local LE around here has discovered I'm very cooperative simply because I have nothing to hide. And things I've done in the past that I would readily admit to? As most of them say, "You got away with it some of the time, you went down hard other times, but you came out learning how to live a better life... pass it on." And where ever possible I do try.

Its taken me many years to learn how to keep my own attitude in check and sometimes lessons just had to be learned the hard way. Now the question I present to everyone is this: Do you think that all LE officers lead a straight arrow life prior to their career in the force?

We're all human, creatures capable of making mistakes, and many very capable of learning from them. Beneath the colors, beneath the badge, we all share the same form, but each and everyone of us has our own unique way of looking at life. When possible we find others who are like minded and a natural bond is formed. Others might not understand it, but if we follow our hearts and minds, being honest to ourselves is what's most important.

The law and the patch have long run circles around each other, and that past echoes into the present all the time. I could share some interesting insight into various cooperations between the law and 1%ers, and how it was perceived on this end. That might help separate the 'rat' analogy from applied co-existence/cooperation. :)

Badger

[FLHT2003]

Badger,

i didnt really know what to expect from your reply, but i assumed (hee hee) that you were a pretty straight up guy. i see so many common bonds between, as you called it, the badge and the patch. to answer your question, of course you already know the answer; we have all gotten away with something, sometime, somewhere. its the simple minded cops and bikers who cant see beyond the patch or badge that give us all a bad name.
thanks for your reply and insight, if your ever down south give me a shout!

Ride Free :usaflag:
FLHT2003